amilo-forum.com

Everything you need to know about Amilo and Lifebook laptops by Fujitsu

Wont start, black screen

All kinds of problems or malfunctions without known reason. Also general problems with the notebook as a whole.

Wont start, black screen

Postby eggz » Fri Dec 03, 2010 5:27 pm

Hi. I'm new here. Seems like a great forum.

Here is my problem:

I have a Amilo Xi 2428. Today I bought a new external LCD monitor. When connecting the new monitor I first removed the old one by disconnecting the VGA cable on the back of the computer while it was turned on. The computer then just died, the built in screen went black. I tried rebooting but it wont start.

The only thing that happens is that the three LEDs to the right light up (HDD, CAPS, SCROLL), nothing else. I have tried removing power and battery, holding the power button and then reconnecting, but the problem persists. I have also tired removing the Hard Drive.

Could it be that the GPU or Motherboard died when i "hot swapped" the VGA cabel?

I have tried searching the forum but have not found the exact same problem. I have no warranty left.

Any help much appreciated.
eggz
 
Posts: 8
Joined: Fri Dec 03, 2010 5:12 pm

Re: Wont start, black screen

Postby hikaru » Mon Dec 06, 2010 9:41 am

Sounds like there was a short-circuit due to ESD when you unplugged the cable. That should not happen but unfortunately sometimes it does happen.
I'm sorry, but I can't give you any advice other than the hardware reset you already did.
User avatar
hikaru
Moderator
 
Posts: 1153
Joined: Thu Oct 25, 2007 9:23 am
Notebook:
  • Dell Precision M6500
  • Amilo Si 1520
  • Desktop
  • Asus EEE 901

Re: Wont start, black screen

Postby eggz » Mon Dec 06, 2010 5:16 pm

Thanks for the reply. Would it be worth fixing the computer or should I just buy a new one?
eggz
 
Posts: 8
Joined: Fri Dec 03, 2010 5:12 pm

Re: Wont start, black screen

Postby hikaru » Mon Dec 06, 2010 9:48 pm

I don't know if it's worth it. The usual way by replacing the whole mainboard with a new one surely isn't worth the money. But you might find a used but still working one (maybe from a Xi 2428 with another defect) or someone you know is an electronics expert and can identify and fix the problem (some computer/TV repair man you might know?).
User avatar
hikaru
Moderator
 
Posts: 1153
Joined: Thu Oct 25, 2007 9:23 am
Notebook:
  • Dell Precision M6500
  • Amilo Si 1520
  • Desktop
  • Asus EEE 901

Re: Wont start, black screen

Postby eggz » Mon Dec 06, 2010 9:57 pm

Thanks again. I left the computer with a computer guy today. Said he'd take look at it and give me an estimate.
eggz
 
Posts: 8
Joined: Fri Dec 03, 2010 5:12 pm

Re: Wont start, black screen

Postby eggz » Thu Dec 09, 2010 2:48 pm

I heard from the computer dude today. He said that the NVIDIA GeForce 8600M GS was dead and that a new replacement wound cost about 300+ USD.

Therefor, my question is. Is it possible to upgrade to a better card? And, how do I know what cards are compatible/fit in the system?
eggz
 
Posts: 8
Joined: Fri Dec 03, 2010 5:12 pm

Re: Wont start, black screen

Postby hikaru » Fri Dec 10, 2010 9:56 am

I did a quick search in our german forum and found that the Xi 2428 has a graphics socket that is called Axiom, which is not compatible to any MXM standard. This means that it will be hard to find replacements via other ways than official support, which in turn means that you'll hardly be able to get it much cheaper. It seems like the ATI Radeon HD2400 might be an alternative.
Unfortunately graphics cards are not my area of expertise, so I can't really help you out.
User avatar
hikaru
Moderator
 
Posts: 1153
Joined: Thu Oct 25, 2007 9:23 am
Notebook:
  • Dell Precision M6500
  • Amilo Si 1520
  • Desktop
  • Asus EEE 901

Re: Wont start, black screen

Postby eggz » Mon Dec 13, 2010 1:35 pm

Thanks for the info. I too did a search in the german forum but my german is not the best :)

Anyway, the data sheet for the Xi 2428 says its MXM II but I guess that is not true then. That really sucks. I cant understand how it can be allowed to sell a product with faulty specifications.
eggz
 
Posts: 8
Joined: Fri Dec 03, 2010 5:12 pm

Re: Wont start, black screen

Postby hikaru » Mon Dec 13, 2010 2:03 pm

eggz wrote:Thanks for the info. I too did a search in the german forum but my german is not the best :)
... and I guess the google translator won't make it any better - right?
It seems to me like in the german forum our user siphon knows a lot about that issue. I can ask him for further input if you like.

eggz wrote:I cant understand how it can be allowed to sell a product with faulty specifications.
You'd be astonished how many errors are in those data sheets.
User avatar
hikaru
Moderator
 
Posts: 1153
Joined: Thu Oct 25, 2007 9:23 am
Notebook:
  • Dell Precision M6500
  • Amilo Si 1520
  • Desktop
  • Asus EEE 901

Re: Wont start, black screen

Postby eggz » Tue Dec 14, 2010 10:38 am

Yes. The google translate works to some extent, but only when the poster used correct grammar and no slang. Which is rare :)

I'de be very thankful if you would ask this siphon, thanks again.
eggz
 
Posts: 8
Joined: Fri Dec 03, 2010 5:12 pm

Re: Wont start, black screen

Postby siphon » Tue Dec 14, 2010 3:27 pm

Unfortunately, I have to confirm everything hikaru has said up to this point.
The card is indeed based on the pretty rare Axiom standard and it should therefore
be very difficult to get hold of a reasonably priced replacement.

Also, I have to admit that I'm unfamiliar with this type of cards myself, I'm pretty experienced
when it comes to the various MXM cards, but I've never actually disassembled or dealt with a laptop
based on the Axiom standard in any sort.

Apart from that, I'm a bit dubious about ESD having killed off the GPU board.
Could you elaborate, or find out how the computer guy came to his conclusion?
Did he test the card in a different laptop, did he swap it with a good one for testing,
or what specifically was his fault finding method? Maybe he just made an educated guess and called it a day...
We don't want to be sent on a wild-goose chase here.
I mean, I do not rule out the possibility for such an event, but in almost 100% of
cases of a failing Axiom card known to me, the failure could be attributed to bad solder
joints in the BGA package of the GPU and not to any other component on the card.
It seems extremely unlikely that this failure pattern could have been triggered by anything else than excessive
heat on the card, and there is still a good chance that indeed an ESD took place, but affected
an entirely different part of the laptop?
I really wouldn't invest any money into this machine at this point, at least not before you can
a 100% pinpoint a faulty card for causing the laptop not to boot up.

And then there would still be the question of an economically viable replacement source.
I only know one by name myself, but I'd not be happy with recommending the company, as I also heard negative stories
about their business practices when it comes to complaint handling in case of GPUs failing again after some time.
I strongly assume that these spare parts shops sell refurbished cards which previously had the a.m. failure pattern,
but I can't evaluate the workmanship of those repaired / furbished cards and therefore would rather like to abstain from any
recommendations/suggestion here.
Sorry for not being of much help here, but try to make 100% sure that the VGA board is the culprit and then
we could take it on from there.
siphon
 
Posts: 2
Joined: Tue Dec 14, 2010 2:16 pm

Re: Wont start, black screen

Postby hikaru » Tue Dec 14, 2010 4:03 pm

@siphon:
Thanks for joining here!
The ESD topic was my idea, so please don't blame the repair man. It just rang my bell when I read of hot swapping the VGA cable.
User avatar
hikaru
Moderator
 
Posts: 1153
Joined: Thu Oct 25, 2007 9:23 am
Notebook:
  • Dell Precision M6500
  • Amilo Si 1520
  • Desktop
  • Asus EEE 901

Re: Wont start, black screen

Postby eggz » Tue Dec 14, 2010 4:03 pm

Thanks siphon for taking the time to register and to post such a detailed reply.

The fact of the matter is that I think that you could be right about the card being to hot. Here is exactly what happened when the computer broke.

I had just bought a new LCD monitor, a 24" HDMI model. I already had one external monitor connected to the VGA port. In hope of being able to run two external monitors I plugged in the new one via HDMI. I then proceeded to try and configure windows to extend my desktop to show on my two external monitors. This did not work. I tried lots of settings and resolutions, causing all monitors (including the built in 15.4") to turn on and off multiple times during a period of maybe 10 minutes. Maybe this could have caused the graphics card to overheat?

The built in screen did go black at just the same time as i disconnected the VGA, but maybe that was just a coincidence then, or maybe just the final straw that cracked the overheated donkeys back?

I dont know exactly how the computer guy came to the conclusion that it was the GPU that had broke. I know that they disassembled the computer but that's all i know. He also said that there was a way that he might be able to fix the card but that it was not worth it because the problem could come back.
eggz
 
Posts: 8
Joined: Fri Dec 03, 2010 5:12 pm

Re: Wont start, black screen

Postby siphon » Tue Dec 14, 2010 4:38 pm

Oh yeah, hikaru was the one who introduced the idea of ESD, dunno why I falsely attributed that to
your repairman. Maybe I should drink more coffee to stay even less focused :roll:
Sry about that :mrgreen:
Seems as if we are on the right path, overheating (mostly due to bad thermal design, bad thermal pads and of course
Nvidias infamous 86** solder issues) is just the most common cause for a failing card.
Maybe switching the monitors around was just coincidence or the final straw.

It's true, those failed cards can be revived for some unknown period of time by amateurishly "baking" them in any
conventional oven at around 190°C or by shortly (3-5 mins?) heating up the VGA Board with a heat gun or a very powerful
blow-dryer, but the defect will most likely come back within a few months or even some weeks.
I had three successful revivals with the heatgun method in cases where I didn't particularly care about the
outcome (the laptops served as basis for 770M Quadros to be installed), but all cards died again within
2-9 months by the latest.
Though, the only viable long-term option I would consider is to have the card reballed by a 1st class repair shop with
all the necessary tools, reballing templates, right solder balls, expertise and so on willing to give at least 12 months warranty on their repair- as it is very unlikely that any purchasable card on the spare parts market is completely new/ non-refurbished, and thus not subject to failing early again - and carrying out the work at a reasonable price.
Don't know about any reballing repair shops though in the US and their terms and prices.
siphon
 
Posts: 2
Joined: Tue Dec 14, 2010 2:16 pm


Return to General problems